The unofficial AFC Rushden & Diamonds messageboard

BartonRaz wrote:

Rushdenjim wrote: No-one is suggesting that the use of "reform" leans itself to close to the old club but Its my personal opinion that records, cups etc should be carried on. Players like Peaks etcd played all their games infront of the same people he would play in front now. I would like to see appearance's contined, most goals and all the other stats carried over!

Don't suppose you want the debts carried over too, do you? ;)

haha. The debt belonged to the company that owned Rushden & Diamonds. The company that owned that club and all other club changes its name or is sold to other companies over time. In around about way we are just about company carrying on the R&D name. Without R&D we would not have AFCR&D. Its something that most not be forgotten. The debt was mismanagement not footballing issues, we should not punish the football just because we have a new name.

We are carrying the R&D name and so we should get all stats and records that come with that name. Minus the debt obviously ;)

I disagree, the debts were football related because they were concerned with the core activity of RDFC and we don't want to be be put into the same category as Sausage and his ilk who are quite happy to walk away from things they don't like but happy to retain those aspects of things that serve their purpose.

Whilst FA may wish to describe us as a 'reformed club' to justify their league placement decision we are, as BR suggests, a new club albeit a 'Phoenix' outfit formed out of the ashes of the sadly defunct RDFC.

The achievements of RDFC remain in the history books and can never be airbrushed away.

AFC Rushden & Diamonds is all about the future and not the past. ;)

But ARE Rushden & Diamonds - the legal entity - actually defunct? Or are they just "inactive"?

as far as i understand it the old club is in administration, going through liquidation - but it does still exist as a business entity. that said, even if they could resurrected it, it'd be a business with no customers.

i think that the thing to bear in mind here is that a football club is about its community, the fans. we should celebrate the heritage of ithlingborough diamonds, rushden town and rushden and diamonds fc in our history - afcr&d is just the next chapter in that history. who else can lay claim to the history of these clubs? some bastardised version dreamed up by it previous owner under the name of east northants utd or some like? a renamed/rebranded K*ttering town fc club that just happens to lodge at nene park? fans make a club ! managers, players and owners come and go, as has been proven with us, the only constant is the fans. as a fan owned club we have every right to celebrate the past successes of all three football clubs and i'm very proud to do so, even though i didn't watch either of the sides pre-merger, but i know we have some fans who did.

the fa, in recognising us as a reformed club, have also shown they see us as the true and rightful owners of that heritage and for that i'm very pleased - sorry for any typos, doing this on my phone, and im not good at that

Red Dragon wrote:But ARE Rushden & Diamonds - the legal entity - actually defunct? Or are they just "inactive"?

I'm not entirely sure, but we still haven't heard of the legal entity of Rushden & Diamonds FC Ltd being actually made defunct, and this site says we're still in administration:

http://www.companiesintheuk.co.uk/ltd/r ... iamonds-fc

So, therefore the club even now still technically exists? How much longer is this going to go on then, I notice the end of the financial year is coming up on Thursday, will that be when the club ceases to exist? Sorry I have very little knowledge of how all this works and I do find it slightly confusing as to why nearly 12 months later RDFC still exists :?

I notice AFC Wimbledon have a merged honours board, along with the statement "The supporters of AFC Wimbledon believe that our club is a continuation of the spirit which formed Wimbledon Old Centrals in 1889 and kept Wimbledon Football Club alive until May 2002. We consider that a football club is not simply the legal entity which controls it, but that it is the community formed by the fans and players working towards a common goal. We therefore reproduce the honours won by what we believe was, and will always be, 'our' club, in our community. "

Formic wrote:I notice AFC Wimbledon have a merged honours board, along with the statement "The supporters of AFC Wimbledon believe that our club is a continuation of the spirit which formed Wimbledon Old Centrals in 1889 and kept Wimbledon Football Club alive until May 2002. We consider that a football club is not simply the legal entity which controls it, but that it is the community formed by the fans and players working towards a common goal. We therefore reproduce the honours won by what we believe was, and will always be, 'our' club, in our community. "

Couldnt agree more. But it looks like this opinion is 50:50

In summary, then:

1) Rushden & Diamonds FC still legally exists, although it is in administration prior to liquidation.

2) AFC Rushden & Diamonds consider themselves to be the moral successors to the heritage of what previously had been Rushden Town FC, Irthlingborough Diamonds FC, and Rushden & Diamonds FC.

3) The FA considers AFC R&D to be the latest incarnation of those former clubs, as it referred to AFC R&D as a "reformed" club: what others might unofficially call a phoenix club.

4) AFC R&D can therefore legitimately claim those honours won by former incarnations, or contributory incarnations, as their own - and thus, presumably, also the playing records of former players.

Okay then... but what happens if - and I know it's moving into the realms of fantasy - K*ttering Town go bust and/or are forced to vacate Nene Park, the current owners of R&DFC manage to sell the business entity to someone of sufficient wealth who clears its debts (legitimately, not all this CVA 10p in the pound piracy which Sausage is about to inflict on local businesses), and either that owner plays hardball with Cousins sufficiently ruthlessly to negotiate a truly realistic rent or purchase for Nene Park, or finds another piece of land on which to build a ground, and starts up the football club again from the bottom.

Who, then, is the legal and moral successor to Rushden & Diamonds FC in its all-Griggs-and-glory years?

Thats a marvellous statement from AFC Wimbledon, and is something I completely agree with 110%. If, to me, this club we support now, wasn't still Rushden & Diamonds, I wouldnt support them. Its not a new club as far as I'm concerned. If we ever loose our true identity, I'll be the first to walk away. I'm a Rushden & Diamonds supporter, whether its AFC... or ...FC.

Rushdenjim wrote:Does this mean all the records R&D holds are contiuned? For example if Andy Peaks starts a game (just making a situation up here) that will be his 206th Appearance or 1st for the club?

I would have thought that as far as player records and results are concerned, they will start from scratch next season as AFC Rushden & Diamonds. Andy Peaks played for Rushden Town prior to the merger, but obviously they were not added to his total appearances for R&DFC. Having said that, I do agree with the majority in that the honours won as R&DFC should be acknowledged as our own.